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User avatar   Experienced Modder Experienced ModderMember since: 01.07.2011, 21:28Posts: 436 Likes: 0
 

 Post Topic: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 04:56 
This doesn't make sense to me, tbh. We, as a whole, could get a lot more done and people could have much more work to show off in their portfolios. We could easily muster a studio of 30+ people working on projects, talk about taking care of business!

User avatar   News Posters News PostersMember since: 02.02.2009, 18:53Posts: 5220 Likes: 79
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 05:01 
Because people are unreliable if they don't get paid. I've worked on some amazing mods in the past, but most of them failed because people left in the middle of the project or everything just fell apart because we weren't organized enough.
It would be hard to gather 30+ people that would share the same idea or wish to work on the same project. Not impossible, but pretty hard.
User avatar   Experienced Modder Experienced ModderMember since: 01.07.2011, 21:28Posts: 436 Likes: 0
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 05:12 
Quote by Vigilante:
Because people are unreliable if they don't get paid. I've worked on some amazing mods in the past, but most of them failed because people left in the middle of the project or everything just fell apart because we weren't organized enough.
It would be hard to gather 30+ people that would share the same idea or wish to work on the same project. Not impossible, but pretty hard.

I thought about this, and honestly I think it comes down to leadership. The right leader can hold a team together through a project, also freedays ( like Free Fridays ) help a ton.
User avatar   News Posters News PostersMember since: 02.02.2009, 18:53Posts: 5220 Likes: 79
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 05:23 
People here usually have other obligations, they can't work on a game 8 hours per day 5 days per week. The most you can get out of them is an hour or two a day, tops. Even with a good leader, people can't work on a game full time unless they get paid.
User avatar   Experienced Modder Experienced ModderMember since: 01.07.2011, 21:28Posts: 436 Likes: 0
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 05:31 
Quote by Vigilante:
People here usually have other obligations, they can't work on a game 8 hours per day 5 days per week. The most you can get out of them is an hour or two a day, tops. Even with a good leader, people can't work on a game full time unless they get paid.

With a team that large they wouldn't have to work full time, assuming everyone does their share of the responsibility.
User avatar   News Posters News PostersMember since: 02.02.2009, 18:53Posts: 5220 Likes: 79
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 05:38 
Quote by ClockworkOnion:
Quote by Vigilante:
People here usually have other obligations, they can't work on a game 8 hours per day 5 days per week. The most you can get out of them is an hour or two a day, tops. Even with a good leader, people can't work on a game full time unless they get paid.

With a team that large they wouldn't have to work full time, assuming everyone does their share of the responsibility.


True, but again, finding a team that big can be a problem. Not to mention that they can leave at any time. I'm not trying to argue with you, I share the same opinion and would love to see a huge Crydev collaboration someday.
User avatar   News Posters News PostersMember since: 20.01.2009, 02:39Posts: 2967Location: Glorious Texas Likes: 251
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 09:43 
Biggest problem I see is the geographical challenges you'd face. We're a very diverse community here. We have Americans, Germans, Brits, Australians, Canadians, French, Czech, Iranians, Poles, and Hungarians to name a few.
Unless you're in Germany (which seems to have the highest concentration of members here) You'd be hard pressed to find someone close to you who is willing to work in a studio.
Heck, I don't think I've ever even seen another Texan on these forums...


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User avatar   Uber Modder Uber ModderMember since: 21.10.2011, 23:50Posts: 1731 Likes: 8
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 10:19 
Well, this wouldn't be the problem as everybody could do home-office. The real problem is the global time shift making members unable to communicate around the globe very fast.

Well, if we could organize st. like that I'd help ya. :D
User avatar   News Posters News PostersMember since: 02.02.2009, 18:53Posts: 5220 Likes: 79
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 10:45 
Quote by NeoLegends:
Well, this wouldn't be the problem as everybody could do home-office. The real problem is the global time shift making members unable to communicate around the globe very fast.

Well, if we could organize st. like that I'd help ya. :D


I would love to help as well if you pull this off. By the way, do you have a game in mind?
User avatar   Uber Modder Uber ModderMember since: 21.10.2011, 23:50Posts: 1731 Likes: 8
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 11:40 
ATM I'm working on a small side project with two friends that has priority. I don't wanna tell detail in public, because the announcement comes when we finished the first area of the map. ;) PM if you wanna know more.
User avatar   Crytek Staff Member Crytek Staff MemberMember since: 11.07.2008, 20:25Posts: 11735Location: Nottingham, UK Likes: 75
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 12:53 
One problem: the distribution of skillsets. How many artists are there, for example, in relation to the number of programmers?

Also, throwing more people at problems is rarely the right solution. You'd be trying to maintain some sort of consistency (art style, code techniques) in a situation where everyone thinks their way is the right way. That's doable in the context of a large studio with some form of management, but in an indie team?


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User avatar   Uber Modder Uber ModderMember since: 21.06.2009, 02:00Posts: 1200 Likes: 0
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 18:06 
Quote by Tracer:
Biggest problem I see is the geographical challenges you'd face. We're a very diverse community here. We have Americans, Germans, Brits, Australians, Canadians, French, Czech, Iranians, Poles, and Hungarians to name a few.
Unless you're in Germany (which seems to have the highest concentration of members here) You'd be hard pressed to find someone close to you who is willing to work in a studio.
Heck, I don't think I've ever even seen another Texan on these forums...

I believe there's a way around this. It's almost impossible for you to be the only CryENGINEER in the entire state of Texas, but not impossible to be the only one on the forums (though I have seen other modders from that state). This brings up possible solution one. There might not be a good number of members in one area that are online (i.e. registered members of Crydev), but if you were to spread the word, then you could bring them to the site as appose to wait for them to join.

As far as having a communication around the world, there might be a solution to that as well. It's not possible for a team that's on a global scale to be communicating with the whole assembly at any one given time. But if you have a series of leaders under a primary leader, then you can have a leader that handles your team in Asia, then when they close operation for the day your leader in the Middle East takes over, then Europe, and then America - and so the chain would loop back around again. So if you have, say, ten team members in each country of the world (more in larger nations) then you would most likely have someone modding at almost every hour of the day. Because you now have that many members in one region, there's bound to be at least one of them that's available to mod. And that's all you need to maintain a flow.
The only problem with this is that, with only one team leader in each country, you can't rely on he/she being available to command that section of team. The solution to this is simple: members are trusted and competent enough to get by on their own for a short while. And of course you would have those who fall out or disagree with one another - show me an organization that doesn't have some degree of strife, and doesn't lose someone every now and then. But with every fall out, you would cope and replace just like every company does. There would be problems along the way, for sure, but that's to be expected the larger your team gets.

The idea is possible, and quite inspiring. I would certainly like to see this pulled off, and you would have my help and support. I'll be the first to start working when the sun hits America. ;)
User avatar   24/7 Modder 24/7 ModderMember since: 23.04.2008, 19:49Posts: 3901Location: Horsham, West Sussex Likes: 59
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 18:35 
several points that would make this a bit difficult to achieve.

1. what are you going to make? you need an idea alot of people will want to work on and have a belief in working on.

2. how are you going to keep that idea from becoming a cluster of random ideas?
ok so you have your idea and people interested, but wait this person wants this to happen. another wants this. they dont want to compromise?

3. the idea isnt really coming together how we planned, now what?

4. we've made some awesome stuff and its really getting somewhere, hang on some companies have come in and hired some of our best people who now dont have that much time to work on the project/or have left. crap.

5. kickstarter kickstarter kickstarter... unproven group of people with an idea and other commitments. no thank you. or a year later "wheres my project or wheres my money"

6. we're making a game with zombies in it! ...no

7. we're making a modern gritty AAA shooter! ...no

8. we're making a AAA open world game! ...no

9. we're making a small single level and some simple game mechanics just to see how it goes. ...yes!

10. now what art style do we use?

11. we thought this guy would be a good leader but he really isnt. he's too bossy and demanding when i have reallife commitments to consider. I have to feed my family!

12. he's too laid back we arent getting anything done!

13. ok we've finished the game! now we have to license every piece of software people used before we can sell it. dont forget the engine!

14. how are we paying for that?


would like to see it work however there are so many factors to take into account, it seems unlikely. still if it was thought out well, I'd probably consider helping.
User avatar   Hardcore Modder Hardcore ModderMember since: 11.10.2011, 18:41Posts: 903Location: Germany Likes: 10
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 30.09.2012, 23:47 
Hi,

sure the distribution of people makes it hard. But the high amount of successful and professional open source projects out there shows that its possible. With the right communication (yeah the beloved term soft skills) and team structure it would be possible. Imho it all depends on the dedication, maturity and professionality of the members.

so long,
oliver
User avatar   Experienced Modder Experienced ModderMember since: 01.07.2011, 21:28Posts: 436 Likes: 0
 

 Post Topic: Re: Why have we never had a community studio?
PostPosted 01.10.2012, 05:25 
So much to address here so I will start, however this post will be very long and I don't include TLDRs so be prepared to read.

Quote:
One problem: the distribution of skillsets. How many artists are there, for example, in relation to the number of programmers?


The way I have it broken down, in my head, is that the programmers and artists need to out number the designers 4 to 1.

I would break it down like this:
-Code Monkeys (Programmers)
(2-4) engine coders to add features that might not exist in the vanilla version of the SDK
(2-4) people for coding shaders, as any project I work on is going to have a lot of custom shaders.
(2) Sound designers; I hate the default sounds for all guns in Crysis 2.
(1-2) UI people.

-Arts
(2-4) 2D artists, there will have to be a LOT of concept art and many new textures, and new UI designs. Also assets.
(4-6) 3D artists, this includes people making new character models, animators, and enviromental artists for new locales across the game world.
(2) Cinematic artists for all those fancy cutscenes.

-Design
(3-4) Designers maybe less for smaller projects are really all that's needed. This should be enough to pump out new ideas, but not too many ideas as the skew the direction of the project or overwhelm the ability of the programming team to implement new ideas or features resulting in less cut features to the finished project.

Oh and I also forgot we would need (1) writer, thankfully one has just joined our ranks!

Quote:
Biggest problem I see is the geographical challenges you'd face. We're a very diverse community here. We have Americans, Germans, Brits, Australians, Canadians, French, Czech, Iranians, Poles, and Hungarians to name a few.


While a challenge it is one that is easily overcame, whichever regions have the most people the most skilled or trusted person in that region becomes the Project Manager in charge of the region. Thankfully since we can add members to projects now any member from any region can work on the game from certain times in their timezone(s) drop the project file or changelog into something like DropBox and then another person in another region can pick it up and start work. Rinse, repeat. Also each region will have a set of design goals that must be met, however members must be self-directed as per what others have said "life happens".


Last edited by ClockworkOnion on 01.10.2012, 05:41, edited 1 time in total.